Votes
- 1: Behemoth, 2: Eruption, 3: Magnetar, 4: Tough as Nails. In a melee like this, Tough as Nails is going to have the rear exposed to Magnetar at some point. Magnetar needs just one hit on the wheels or the ram to end TaN's chances in this melee. However, Magnetar's starring role ends there as the broken srimech will cause it issues as soon as it is against two flippers. However, both robots will take a knock before Magnetar goes over, and we saw how Eruption's flipper pretty much died in its actual melee after the hits. Behemoth shouldn't lose power like that, and can turn Eruption over to take victory. Jimlaad43(talk) 10:29, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1: Magnetar, 2: Eruption, 3: Tough as Nails, 4. Behemoth. What's the common theme with Behemoth? It has an atrocious record in group battles. It was bullied in the Southern Annihilator, it came third against Carbide and Nuts, it was the first eliminated in the All Stars melee with Dantomkia and the Mayhem with Thermidor 2, it barely survived the first round melee in Series 6. That leaves the Series 8 melee where Carbide beat the other two first, and the Series 7 melee where it was miles ahead of the competition. History points to Behemoth bombing another ground battle with all-stars. It's also pretty decisive how easily Behemoth overturns itself. It's tremendously vulnerable against Eruption, who it can barely faze, Tough As Nails, given its predisposition to rear up and overturn itself, and Magnetar who had it beat in Series 10 and can knock it out the way Sabretooth did. I'm fully confident in Behemoth ending up OOTA or in the pit. Of the other three, its heartbreakingly true that TAN is vulnerable; it could certainly threaten Eruption but only by exposing itself to Magnetar. Between Magnetar and Eruption, I think the winner was clear sans Matilda's tusks. I chose not to predict that happening again. Toon Ganondorf (t c) 10:55, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1. Behemoth, 2. Tough as Nails, 3. Eruption, 4. Magnetar. let’s go bold! Magnetar to fall first. It won’t go out before having a massive influence on the fight - likely rupturing Eruption’s C02 like it did in real life, but still. The potential of the srimech to fail at some point is just too high - especially against an invertible hardox machine, and two flippers. Eruption will feel the effect of the C02 next - allowing Tough as Nails to completely smother it. Behemoth will then rack up the flips on the nice, wide machine that is Tough as Nails to take a Judges’ decision. Tough as Nails could take the decision itself if it pits Eruption - but who knows how likely the Pit is to open. It could also be severely limping at this point anyway if Magnetar hits it in a bad spot. Nweston8 (talk) 10:59, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1. Behemoth; 2. Tough as Nails; 3. Eruption; 4. Magnetar. Before I start the justification for my vote, let's just get it out of the way that with four presses of the Doom Dial between all of these robots, the pit will open for the benefit of Tough as Nails. For the sakes of its later head-to-heads, I have a request for Jimlaad - for every Tough as Nails, I'd like to see you officially randomise the outcome of the Doom Dial press for each robot in the fight. Knowing whether the pit will, or will not open, makes all the difference. My bottom two here are Magnetar and Eruption, and this is based upon their real fight in Series 10. Magnetar will likely disable Eruption's gas supply again, as it's more than welcome to attack the robot which is visibly holding back. However, the self-righting troubles will come into effect - we need only swap Matilda for Behemoth. Magnetar is gone first, and Eruption is crippled, making it easy pickings for Tough as Nails to grab its comparatively boxy chassis, and dump it in the pit. Just a slight response to Jimlaad, by the way - it's entirely possible that Magnetar could hit Tough as Nails around the back, but what would that achieve? Hitting its hydraulic ram can only leave it weaponless at best, it's the wheels or nothing, and I can't see TaN as a priority target. This fight now comes down to a head-to-head between Behemoth and Tough as Nails, but the six-wheeled pusher will blatantly overpower the Dutch machine, eventually dropping it into the pit. TOAST 11:10, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- TaN won't work properly without the gripping ability. The claws flopping around don't give the robot consistency. Plus it's the axle that keeps the wheels pointing in the same direction. You just need to watch any Formula E session to see how wheels pointing in the wrong direction makes it impossible to drive. What's to say that the ram will be the only damaged thing, a hit on the back is very close to the internals, and an exploding ram will put lots of stress on the internals. Anyway, what's to stop TaN flying high and landing wheels first on the drum again? Push to Exit, Expulsion, Thor AND Rapid all flew up and landed on Magnetar again after a hit. TaN is just as vulnerable. Jimlaad43(talk) 11:30, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1: Eruption, 2:Magnetar , 3: Tough as Nails, 4. Behemoth Ok why's everyone overrating Behemoth? As Toon said it has a bad track record for group battles, what's worse is it's against Eruption, who can flip it, Magnetar, who can damage the underbelly and TaN, who can grab it. There's literally no logical way that Behemoth can succeed. As for TaN its wheels and back end is vulnerable and will be heavily damage. Magnetar, as destructive as it is, can't self right more than once and seeing as it happened in real life...Diotoir the son of nemesis (talk) 12:23, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- Yes, and as I said, most of those points are not really relevant. Nobody is overrating Behemoth. CrashBash (talk) 12:33, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1st: Eruption, 2nd: Behemoth, 3rd: Magnetar, 4th: Tough As Nails. First of all, this needs to be gotten out of the way. Whilst TG does bring up some points about Behemoth bombing melees, I feel that nearly none of them are applicable here. The annihilator example was at the end of the round when Behemoth was running low on battery power, a problem it showed to be a problem during the Fourth (and indeed Third) series, but was fixed thereafter. The Nuts 2/Carbide battle was, as the article itself describes, a series of unexpected and unfortunate events, something that'd be extremely difficult to replicate (especially with no bar spinner present). The Dantomkia/Thermidor examples are a little less relevant because there are far fewer places where Behemoth can be thrown out of the arena in the first place, and lets not forget about its Series 9 melee, where it certainly did not struggle all that much. With all that, Behemoth still stands as much of a chance as anyone else, and will. The robot most in trouble is Tough As Nails. Even assuming the pit does open, it's going to find it very difficult to grab anyone except Behemoth, who can simply outpush it. I'm buying the logic that if Magnetar can get a good hit on the rear, that'll kill it, otherwise, it'll just get a taste of its own medicene. So, that leaves Eruption, Behemoth and Magnetar. What then? Well, I'd argue that Magnetar was winning its clash with Eruption before the CPZ incident, however, it's facing two flippers, not one. In a worst case scenario between the three, Eruption will end up with very little gas in its flipper, Behemoth will be left immobile on one side and Magnetar's srimech will malfunction. With two flippers, the latter of the three seems very likely, and eventually, Magnetar is going to get itself overturned. This leaves us potentially with a weakened Eruption and a crippled Behemoth, and I'm fairly sure Eruption will know how to play this battle. It could potentially get Behemoth out of the arena if all three are working properly, but that'd put it under pressure from Magnetar. It may see Magnetar as the bigger threat and go for it first - remember how it went for Aftershock before Crackers 'n' Smash? From there, the rest is simple. CrashBash (talk) 12:32, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1: Magnetar, 2: Behemoth, 3: Tough As Nails, 4: Eruption. Now, I have to disagree with CrashBash on the idea that Tough as Nails cannot grab anyone apart from Behemoth. Because back in 2015, I attended a battle between Tough As Nails and Eruption (also featuring Tiberius 4), where whenever Eruption flipped Tough As Nails, it would allow the latter to grab hold of it by the rear (on another note, Michael Oates was angry with the result!). Now, with extra weight and larger size, I think that if the same scenario occurs here, Tough as Nails should now have total control over the flipper, unlike in Colchester. A pitting to occur. As for Magnetar and Behemoth, they will be fighting each other, whereby the same outcome of Behemoth being left crippled will happen. As a result, Magnetar and Tough as Nails will face each other, with Magnetar winning out by flipping its opponent and then taking out the rear. This will take time, however, and so the 'error that cost Magnetar the title' will not happen here, meaning that Magnetar will survive to the judges' decision, easily beating out Behemoth. SpaceManiac888 (Talk) 15:17, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1: Eruption, 2: Behemoth, 3: Magnetar, 4: Tough as Nails. Well, Tough as Nails is easy fodder for all the others, so it goes first. Then it's a question of what comes first: Magnetar getting flipped twice, or Behemoth getting OotAd by Eruption. I'd say both flippers would target the spinner and make sure the former comes first. Hogwild94 (talk) 17:35, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- As I mentioned in my vote and based on the video linked above, Tough As Nails should actually defeat Eruption, so I am not sure why you consider it 'fodder' against the flipper. SpaceManiac888 (Talk) 17:37, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- It certainly poses an interesting theory of what to do. I have Magnetar in fourth place in my current vote, and while I think that's accurate, I think the idea of Eruption coming fourth is far more likely than Tough as Nails coming fourth, based on the assumption that TAN will defeat Eruption. Currently TAN is lined up to be eliminated at this stage, with three votes putting it in fourth, yet if Eruption gets another vote in fourth place, I could technically change my vote to ensure the survival of Tough as Nails. It's an interesting moral dilemma - do I vote with the exact outcome I predicted in the first place, or do I vote in a way which saves Tough as Nails from coming last, the more likely scenario overall... TOAST 18:58, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1: Eruption, 2: Behemoth, 3: Magnetar, 4: Tough as Nails - Ok, starting with SM88's video- I'm not surprised Michael Oates was angry! Yes, Tough as Nails managed to grab hold of Eruption's rear twice when it got flipped over, but it did absolutely nothing with it- on one of the two occasions Eruption was still resisting. It then got lobbed around the arena repeatedly, technically pitted twice, and then Eruption got pitted by a machine that had been immobile since the very first attack. Yeah, I can see why he's annoyed. Tough as Nails doesn't really have an answer to any machine in the battle, and if it does manage to grab hold of Eruption here it leaves the door wide open for Magnetar to obliterate the rear end. And yeah, I'd agree that that'd immobilise it. I can see Eruption doing as it tried in this match IRL and leave Magnetar and Behemoth to fight, which left Behemoth a sitting duck and Magnetar with the srimech wide open. Michael Oates spots that the srimech's failed, kills off Magnetar, and then finishes off Behemoth. Combatwombat555 (talk) 20:42, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- I agree that TAN wasn't really able to push Eruption around much when it had the grip, but it's worth remembering the melee environment - if TAN holds Eruption in a compromising position, Magnetar can sweep in and end it. I think the steel floor should make it easier to push Eruption too, it's generally a more slippery surface. TOAST 21:09, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1: Behemoth, 2: Eruption, 3: Tough As Nails, 4: Magnetar: Behemoth has the experience to avoid Eruption longer while dealing with the other two, possibly even lifting Magnetar over to it's back while TAN can pit it, only to be pitted itself shortly after. BizarroKing (talk) 21:12, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- 1. Magnetar, 2. Tough as Nails, 3. Eruption, 4. Behemoth. If anything, this melee is even more open than the last. Anyone COULD win this, but I simply don't think the World Championship battle between Eruption and TaN provides enough proof that TaN will snatch it. It certainly wouldn't claw its way out of this pit, and it was Tiberius 4 who actually finished off Eruption. That said, I think that both machines, in fact all four machines, will reach a Judges' Decision. Why? Well, let's take a look. Magnetar had practically beat both Eruption and Behemoth in their respective fights without knocking either out until control let it down twice. I don't think Magnetar will get the chance to launch an attack on Tough As Nails' wheels, but if it does manage to get Behemoth to stop driving on one side, and damage Eruption's flipper/gas, who is to say it then simply won't go after Tough As Nails and leave the others alone? Why risk being flipped over if you can simply go after a robot that simply can't beat you? The only way the Dutch machine has a glimmer of hope against Magnetar is if it perfectly times a charge from the side, and even then it'll struggle to keep a hold of such a short robot of Magnetar's length. Magnetar lasted a long time in the arena with two flippers, with a srimech that only worked on the first try, so why've shouldn't that happen again, alongside the presence of Tough as Nails? Behemoth to be left spinning on the spot, Eruption floundering with a severely weakened flipper, and Magnetar and Tough as Nails duking it out in a war of attrition. All four to survive, with Magnetar winning on damage and aggression, and Tough as Nails edging out Eruption on aggression and due to taking less damage. Raz3r(talk) 21:44, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- Can I recommend for these melees that the decision as to who goes through is slightly altered? Everyone's votes are so different in these melees (just look at my vote and BizarroKing's above, which are in a complete reverse order, as one example) that I think we should introduce a points system to make results seem a bit fairer, whereby the robot gains one point for first place per vote, two points for second, three points for third etc. Robot with the fewest points goes through in first, and it'll also help decide the Redemption Round places. For example, in this melee so far, Eruption would have 23 points, Behemoth 24 points, Magnetar 29 points and Tough as Nails 34, so Eruption wins and Tough as Nails is last. While Behemoth has the most votes in first so far, 4 compared to Eruption and Magnetar on 3, it's also been voted last 3 times, with Eruption only voted last once and a Magnetar 3 times. Hence while Behemoth has been the most popular first choice, Eruption is actually the more consistent robot in our voting so far. Raz3r(talk) 22:16, April 17, 2018 (UTC)
- Makes sense to me, even if you've listed it in the wrong order - it'd be three points for getting first place, not one! Between this and my suggestion for preselecting the Doom Dial outcomes for the next TAN fight, there's room for a lot of innovation in this brilliant Grand Final! TOAST 13:57, April 18, 2018 (UTC)
- 1: Tough as Nails 2: Behemoth 3: Magnetar 4: Eruption. This is really too close to call - honestly, I have no idea on how this melee is going to turn out. But, I suppose I have to give my predictions – and I predict that we are going to be in for a lot of surprises. Considering the video which SpaceManiac mentioned, I should think that Michael Oates will learn from experience by avoiding Tough as Nails altogether and hanging Eruption back in the early stages. However, what are the chances of it being ganged up on by the others as what happened in real life? Magnetar certainly proved capable of pushing Eruption around and damaging its CO2 system, and Behemoth is more than capable of landing a swift flip of death if Eruption loses much of its gas supply early on. Behemoth and Magnetar proved to be evenly matched in their Redemption Round, and there is always the prospect of the latter damaging Behemoth’s drive after a couple of blows, leaving Behemoth spinning in circles for the remainder of the battle. But what about Tough as Nails? Its wheels and pneumatic ram are exposed, offering prime targets for Magnetar’s drum to damage or incapacitate. It also proved suspect against opponents with more powerful drive systems - even if the drum and srimech malfunction, I can picture Magnetar outpushing Tough as Nails for the most part, considering how easily it pushed Eruption around in real life. What if, however, it encounters Behemoth, and the latter suddenly throws it over? Without a working srimech, Magnetar is finished! And considering that Tough as Nails’ claws have already proved capable of clamping Behemoth with ease, I can easily see it taking advantage of its surviving opponent’s drive issues and pushing it to the hazards – possibly down the pit. Considering all the variables at play, a shock victory for Tough as Nails might be possible providing that the Dutch machine can tank Magnetar’s initial blows and stay out of trouble. VulcansHowl 13:47, April 18, 2018 (UTC)
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